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Old 02-05-2007, 03:03 AM   #1
JIO
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Default i2 batteries slowly dying?......

About a month ago, in cold weather, when I charged my i2's batteries, the green indicator lights would be flickering showing that the batteries were charged. When I start it up though, only 6 of the 8 bars would be showing. I ran the batteries down to zero thinking they needed to be calibrated with the infokey, but to no avail...still only 6 bars at full charge.

Three weeks ago I went on vacation and decided to bring the i2 into the house rather than the garage to keep it nice and warm. Well tonight I started the i2 for the first time in 3 weeks and there are now only 4 bars showing. The lights are still flashing green with "full charge" but really only 1/2 charge.

Is it time for new batteries? Is this the first sign of failure? I emailed my dealer to see if he'll order new batteries for me. The i2 is only 3 months old and I have tried 3 different power cables thinking at first it wasn't making a good connection, and not really charging....but the connection is fine.

Is it going to be worth removing the batteries and doing a reset, or are the batteries gone?
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Old 02-05-2007, 07:00 AM   #2
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Well every one is going to tell you to "condition" them. Run 'em all the way down. Ride the machine as far as you are comfortable and then leave it on till it quits. Then charge it. Check your manual. You are really not reconditioning the Lithiums but recalibrating the system, I think. You'll get more posts.

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Old 02-05-2007, 09:59 AM   #3
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Default Been there

The lithium batteries are apparently still having more than their share of problems. I went through two pairs of replacement packs for my i167 before getting a 'good' pair. Then, one of the packs on my i2 started giving safety shutdowns when cold, and soon after the machine became unrideable. The warranty replacements, now a few weeks old, took care of that problem, but only gave 14.5 miles compared to over 20 on my i180 on the same course.

Then, yesterday, I went for a four mile glide on a full charge, and used up four bars. If the gauge is as linear as I've heard, that means I'm down to an 8 mile range - barely enough to get to work.

If you need warranty replacements, INC will send them to you on a dummy powerbase so you can return the faulty ones, and they'll charge you over $1700 until they get them back. But, as I've learned the hard way, they won't automatically credit your card until you call them with the tracking number. Apparently the RMA number on the box doesn't automatically trigger that.

It's a major hassle, and it looks like I'm about to go through it for the fourth time. Don't quit until you've got a good pair. They've got a one year warranty.
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Old 02-05-2007, 10:22 AM   #4
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Default How's your range?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JIO View Post
About a month ago, in cold weather, when I charged my i2's batteries, the green indicator lights would be flickering showing that the batteries were charged. When I start it up though, only 6 of the 8 bars would be showing. I ran the batteries down to zero thinking they needed to be calibrated with the infokey, but to no avail...still only 6 bars at full charge.

Three weeks ago I went on vacation and decided to bring the i2 into the house rather than the garage to keep it nice and warm. Well tonight I started the i2 for the first time in 3 weeks and there are now only 4 bars showing. The lights are still flashing green with "full charge" but really only 1/2 charge.

Is it time for new batteries? Is this the first sign of failure? I emailed my dealer to see if he'll order new batteries for me. The i2 is only 3 months old and I have tried 3 different power cables thinking at first it wasn't making a good connection, and not really charging....but the connection is fine.

Is it going to be worth removing the batteries and doing a reset, or are the batteries gone?

Could be either - I had a calibration issue a few weeks out of the box - persisted until I ran the machine down. When I would start up the machine, it would show 3 bars. After I rode a bit (3 miles) it would increase to 4/5/6 bars and hold somewhere in there. One day - I rode 9 miles, all on the 3rd bar. Parked the machine, when I fired it up 8 hours later, it had 5. Happened again (to a lesser degree)when I yanked the battery out of the infokey.

Now, I did eventually have a battery issue 3 months later, but the charge bars displayed correctly, but my range had fallen to 10 miles a charge.
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Old 02-05-2007, 04:07 PM   #5
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I did condition the batteries. I ran them down until the unit turned off and then recharged them for 12 hours. Still only 6 of the 8 bars showing. I can't believe with Lithium Ion batteries that killing them to zero several times is good for them. Maybe with the NiMh, but not the ion batteries....Am I wrong?
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Old 02-05-2007, 05:23 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JIO View Post
I can't believe with Lithium Ion batteries that killing them to zero several times is good for them. Maybe with the NiMh, but not the ion batteries....Am I wrong?
If they got down to 0 volts, then yes, that's very bad, and the batteries will probably not recharge.

The segway doesn't let them get that low. With the new gen2 batteries, even after a battery related safety shutdown, they should still not drain past the 'point of no return'. I would still recharge them sooner rather than later, especially when you know they are low from a long glide.

I don't know if the saphions are similiar, but for other lithium batteries, 4.2 volts per cell is 100% charge, and 3.0 volts per cell is 0% charge.
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Old 02-05-2007, 06:55 PM   #7
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My range has been low....12 miles and I'm down to 1 bar showing. That's when it was new. I just figured it was the cold weather. But now my range is down to about 8 miles with 1 bar showing. I don't like being too far from home when I get to one bar. The weather is still cold, but 8 miles total?
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Old 02-05-2007, 08:29 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JIO View Post
My range has been low....12 miles and I'm down to 1 bar showing. That's when it was new. I just figured it was the cold weather. But now my range is down to about 8 miles with 1 bar showing. I don't like being too far from home when I get to one bar. The weather is still cold, but 8 miles total?
What's cold? 40 or -3?

At 45 - I still get 85% of my distance from an indoor storage point and assuming I've added a couple punds to the tires. I have a flat run and am able to get 21 on a hot day, 18 when cold (relatively).

I would think 12 and 8 would be very poor unless you are running 10lbs in the tires. I can say that at one point I did such, and was only getting like 13 when it was 50 out.

All temps are of course, F. 50 C... whew hot.
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Old 02-06-2007, 12:25 AM   #9
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By cold in Oregon, I'm talking 20 to 35 F. I'm also running my tires at 18 psi. I don't mind the harsher ride at all. It should give me max mileage, but so far maximum mileage for me is no where close to 20 miles or so.
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Old 02-06-2007, 01:41 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JIO View Post
By cold in Oregon, I'm talking 20 to 35 F. I'm also running my tires at 18 psi. I don't mind the harsher ride at all. It should give me max mileage, but so far maximum mileage for me is no where close to 20 miles or so.
At that temperature, without the batteries insulated, I'd expect no more than about 12 miles (20km). (in my experience)

I have my batteries insulated with heat reflective emergency blanket wrapped around about 1/4" of foam on the outside of the batteries. Even still, at about 20-30F I used 6 (2 left) bars in about 7-8 miles. Tires at exactly 15psi.

So if you're batteries have a problem, I guess mine do to. Anybody else have similar experience? I am assuming this kind of range reduction is normal due to voltage depression in the batteries. The weather hasn't been any warmer than 10c (50f) for me to have any experience at higher temperatures.
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